We read of a great multitude that no man
could number:
Re 7:9
After this I beheld, and, lo, a
great multitude, which no man could number, of all
nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before
the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;
However, this verse is further rendered in
the Young’s Literal Translation (YLT) as:
Re 7:9 After these things I saw, and lo, a great
multitude, which to number no one was able, out of all nations, and tribes, and
peoples, and tongues, standing before the throne, and before the Lamb, arrayed
in white robes, and palms in their hands,
This translation shows that “no one” was
able in and of themselves to number this great multitude and not “no man”. So,
since the scene is in heaven it is apparent that “no one” includes all beings
in heaven (except God, of course, He was the one who saved them individually
and He is able to number the very hairs on our heads, Matt 10:30 and Luke
12:7). Now why is it then that no created being (all beings in heaven were
created by God) could number this great multitude? Is it because the shear
number is so large that it is impossible to count them? Well, I do not believe
so. The earth’s population is approaching 7 billion and each person can be
counted. So, then, the shear magnitude of the number is not the reason why this
great multitude cannot be numbered. Well, to get a credible solution let us
look some more at this great multitude. We are told that they are the ones that
came from earth into heaven out of great tribulation:
Rev 7:13 ¶ And
one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in
white robes? and whence came they?
14 And
I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which
came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white
in the blood of the Lamb.
Now when did these people constituting the
great multitude experience salvation (i.e. the new birth of their resurrected
souls)? Well, a search of the Bible does not reveal such a time. We do not find
explicit language that the great multitude is saved during a particular time
period such as the church age or the great tribulation at the end of time. The
language simply states that they were changing their residence from earth to
heaven and it was a bodily change because of their array in white robes with
palms in their hands. Well, what conclusion can we then draw pertaining to the
timing of the salvation of these people making up the great multitude?
Now the Apostle John was receiving a
vision of things that must happen after his time (from all indication John
received this vision somewhere around 90 AD):
Re 4:1
After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven:
and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking
with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter.
So, the only period of great tribulation
that the Bible speaks of that will occur after 90 AD is the one our Lord Jesus
spoke of:
Mt 24:21
For then shall be great tribulation,
such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever
shall be.
Now from all indications this great tribulation
commenced in 1988 AD and could possibly end in 2011 AD (see study on “The
parable of the ten virgins”) and so it is after the end of this period that
these people constituting the great multitude are coming into heaven from the
earth. This makes abundant sense as our Lord Jesus tells us about this further:
Matt 24: 29 Immediately after the tribulation of those
days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the
stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And
then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the
tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the
clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And
he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect
from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. {with…: or, with a trumpet, and a great voice}
Our Lord further delineates
for us that there will be some period of days after the great tribulation (GT)
and it is then that the rapture of these people will occur (not at the very end
of the GT but in those days thereafter):
Mark 13: 24 ¶ But in those days, after that
tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her
light,
25 And
the stars of heaven shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be
shaken.
26 And
then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and
glory.
27 And then shall he send his angels,
and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost
part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.
So then these people of the
great multitude will come into heaven from earth in their immortal bodies
thereby transferring their residence sometime after the GT! Presently, I
believe the period of time after the GT will be five months (See: “The
Length of the Day of the Lord” and “The
Sequence of Events of the Day of the Lord”):
Re 9:5 And to them it was given that they should not
kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a
scorpion, when he striketh a man.
Re 9:10
And they had tails like unto scorpions, and there were stings in their
tails: and their power was to hurt men five months.
And this period mirrors the
five months of the flood judgment in the days of Noah:
Gen 7: 24 And
the waters prevailed upon the earth an hundred and fifty days.
It is then at the end of
these five months that the rapture will occur, even the very last day thereof
as our Lord testifies four times and His testimony being echoed by Martha, who
heard Him:
Joh 6:39
And this is the Father’s will which hath sent me, that of all which he
hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
Joh 6:40
And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the
Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up
at the last day.
Joh 6:44 No
man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will
raise him up at the last day.
Joh 6:54
Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I
will raise him up at the last day.
Joh 11:24
Martha saith unto him, I know that he shall rise again in the
resurrection at the last day.
So now we know the very time
from scriptures that this great multitude is coming into heaven but we still
have no indication as to when they were saved except that they were saved
before the GT ended. So the conclusion then must be that this great multitude
must comprise those that were saved prior to the start of the GT and have lived
through the GT unto its end as well as those that become saved during the GT
and are alive at its end.
But we still have not
resolved the original concern pertaining to why no one was able in and of
themselves to number the great multitude. Well, to help us understand why this
is so, let us take a look at the background of this great multitude. We find
that the scriptures tell us that they are amongst the children (seed) of
Abraham by faith:
Ge 13:16 And I will make thy seed as the dust of
the earth: so that if a man can number the dust of
the earth, then shall thy seed also be numbered.
And the YLT
version thereof:
16 And
I have set thy seed as dust of the earth, so that, if one is able to number the
dust of the earth, even thy seed is numbered;
Ge 17:5 Neither shall thy name any more be called
Abram, but thy name shall be Abraham; for a father of many nations have I made
thee. {Abraham: that is, Father of a great multitude}
So then the great multitude that comes out
of the GT is the ultimate fulfillment of God’s promises to Abraham and even as
no man or no one can number the dust of the earth, so it is that the great
multitude can not be numbered. But, again, we know that all the governments of
this world take population censuses of their citizenry and this was a practice
in
Nu 1:2
Take ye the sum of all the congregation of the children of
To the entering of Canaan, when
Nu 26: 1 ¶ And
it came to pass after the plague, that the LORD spake unto Moses and unto
Eleazar the son of Aaron the priest, saying, 2
Take the sum of all the congregation of the
children of Israel, from twenty years old and upward, throughout their fathers’
house, all that are able to go to war in Israel.
De 1:10
The LORD your God hath multiplied you, and, behold, ye are this
day as the stars of heaven for multitude.
Even
through to the birth of our Lord Jesus:
Luke 2:1 1 ¶ And
it came to pass in those days, that there went out a decree from Caesar
Augustus, that all the world should be taxed. {taxed: or, enrolled}
So we find that enumerating of the peoples
of this world have always been taking place, so why can no one (apart from God
himself) number the great multitude? Well, let us focus a bit on some
comparative “great multitudes” of scriptures where we find the same Greek words
for “great” and “multitude” employed as we find in Rev 7:9:
Re 7:9
After this I beheld, and, lo, a great <4183> multitude <3793>, which no man could number, of all
nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and
before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;
Sample verses employing the same Greek
words:
Mt 4:25
And there followed him great <4183> multitudes of people <3793> from Galilee, and from Decapolis, and from
Mt 8:1
When he was come down from the mountain, great <4183> multitudes <3793> followed him.
Mt 14:14
And Jesus went forth, and saw a great <4183> multitude <3793>, and was moved with compassion toward
them, and he healed their sick.
Mt 20:29
And as they departed from
Mt 26:47
And while he yet spake, lo, Judas, one of the twelve, came, and with him
a great <4183> multitude <3793> with swords and staves, from the chief priests and elders of the
people.
Mr 4:1
And he began again to teach by the sea side: and there was gathered unto
him a great <4183> multitude <3793>, so that he entered into a ship, and sat in the sea; and the
whole multitude was by the sea on the land.
Mr 9:14
And when he came to his disciples, he saw a great <4183> multitude <3793> about them, and the scribes questioning with them.
Mr 14:43
And immediately, while he yet spake, cometh Judas, one of the twelve,
and with him a great <4183> multitude <3793> with swords and staves, from the chief priests and the scribes
and the elders.
Joh 6:2
And a great <4183> multitude <3793> followed him, because they saw his miracles which he did on them
that were diseased.
Okay, so what can we infer from this
sample of verses? It is very apparent that the great multitude in every instant
can be counted and the term is used to denote a group of people considerably
larger than expected as compared to the norm for that specific occasion. And,
so we must conclude the same about Rev 7:9: As compared to the number of people
already in heaven in bodily form (Enoch, Moses, Elijah, the saints that rose
after Jesus’ resurrection, etc.) which was the norm previously, those coming
out of the GT, relatively, were a great multitude! That is what we can
conclude: Rev 7:9 is not focused on the magnitude of the multitude in isolation
but in comparison to the other group in heaven which did not come out of great
tribulation!
But why can they not be
counted by anyone? The answer, I believe, is simply that no man knows who else
is a saved person because in the material realm the elect have no observable
mark of identification for delineation from the unsaved. Also, the scriptures
do not indicate that the heavenly created beings have any greater knowledge
than man beforehand in this regard except that the angels (a class of the
created beings) become aware of the persons that are elected to salvation as
they receive their individual responsibilities:
Heb 1:14
Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them
who shall be heirs of salvation?
For the rest of the heavenly
created beings, they watch the marvel of salvation unfolding before them whilst
giving God the glory, salvation is even a mystery for them also:
Eph 3:7 Whereof I was made a minister, according to
the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his
power.
8 Unto me, who am less than the least of all
saints, is this grace given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the
unsearchable riches of Christ;
9 And
to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the
world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:
10 To the intent that now unto the
principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the
church the manifold wisdom of God,
11 According to the eternal purpose which he
purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:
ADDENDUM
The following material is being added to
this study as the study was circulated to a broad cross section of Internet Christians
for their comments. Below are their comments and if needed there is a response
from the author:
Comments received
from Joe:
Hi Paul – What you have presented above seems very
reasonable to me. Especially when we look at all the verses you presented
where the word combination “great <4183> multitude <3793>” are used
together, we find groups that are larger than what would normally be expected,
but certainly not in the “millions”.
Re
7:9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man
could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood
before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in
their hands;
But let me throw this out to you to offer another
vantage point. The language of Rev. 7:9 sounds a lot like some other
verses found in the Old Testament where we aren’t going to find that Greek
combination of words used. When God talks about national
Genesis 15:5 And he brought him forth abroad,
and said, Look now toward heaven, and tell the stars, if thou be able to
number them: and he said unto him, So shall thy seed be.
Genesis 32:12 And thou saidst, I will surely do
thee good, and make thy seed as the sand of the sea, which cannot be
numbered for multitude.
Jeremiah 33:22 As the host of heaven cannot
be numbered, neither the sand of the sea measured: so will I
multiply the seed of David my servant, and the Levites that minister unto me.
Hosea 1:10 Yet the number of the children of
Israel shall be as the sand of the sea, which cannot be measured nor
numbered; and it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said
unto them, Ye are not my people, there it shall be said unto them, Ye are the
sons of the living God.
Response by Author:
Joe,
We read of the plague of
Baalpeor that
Num 25: 1 ¶ And Israel abode in Shittim, and the people began to commit whoredom
with the daughters of
2 And
they called the people unto the sacrifices of their gods: and the people did
eat, and bowed down to their gods.
3 And
4 And
the LORD said unto Moses, Take all the heads of the people, and hang them up
before the LORD against the sun, that the fierce anger of the LORD may be
turned away from
5 And
Moses said unto the judges of
We find that the plague above
occurred during the last encampment (42nd) before crossing
Num 33:49 And
they pitched by
Aaron, the first High Priest,
had already died at age 123 years at a much earlier encampment but still within
the 40th year after leaving
Num 33: 37 And
they removed from Kadesh, and pitched in
38 And
Aaron the priest went up into
39 And
Aaron was an hundred and twenty and three years old when he died in
So we know that the timing of
this plague, in which 24,000 was killed (Num 25:9) but 23,000 thereof died in a
single 24-hour period at the very heights of the plague (1Cor 10:8) in late
1408 BC to early 1407 BC, is correct!
It was right after this
plague that the second enumeration of
Num 26: 1 ¶ And
it came to pass after the plague, that the LORD spake unto Moses and unto
Eleazar the son of Aaron the priest, saying,
2 Take the sum of all the congregation of the
children of
The number of the sons of
51 These were the numbered of the children
of
Now let us assume the females
and sons below 20 years are 10 times the number of men (a generous multiplier
just for illustrative purposes), then the total population of
Now it was also at this time
that Moses declared in his farewell speech (just before dying at 120 years)
that God had multiplied
Deut 1: 3 And it came to pass in the fortieth
year, in the eleventh month, on the first day of the month, that
Moses spake unto the children of Israel, according unto all that the LORD had
given him in commandment unto them;……
5 On
this side
6 The
LORD our God spake unto us in Horeb, saying, Ye have dwelt long enough in this
mount:
7 Turn you, and take your journey, and go to the
mount of the Amorites, and unto all the places nigh thereunto, in the
plain, in the hills, and in the vale, and in the south, and by the sea side, to
the land of the Canaanites, and unto
8 Behold, I have set the land before you: go in
and possess the land which the LORD sware unto your fathers, Abraham, Isaac,
and Jacob, to give unto them and to their seed after them.
9 ¶ And
I spake unto you at that time, saying, I am not able to bear you myself alone:
10 The LORD your God hath multiplied
you, and, behold, ye are this day as the stars of heaven for multitude.
11 (The LORD God of your fathers make you a
thousand times so many more as ye are, and bless you, as he hath
promised you!)
I am including below the
Young’s Literal Translation version of verses 10 and 11 to illustrate that
verse 11 is not a prophecy for the future multiplying Israel but rather it is
showing that God had already multiplied them a thousand times thereby
fulfilling the prophesy made to their forefathers:
10 Jehovah your God hath multiplied you, and lo,
ye are to-day as the stars of the heavens for multitude;
11 Jehovah, God of your fathers, is adding to
you, as ye are, a thousand times, and doth bless you as He hath spoken
to you.
This conclusion is further
cemented in Nehemiah’s declaration as he too held that God had already
fulfilled His promise of multiplication by the time of entering the
Neh 9:23 Their children also multipliedst thou as the
stars of heaven, and broughtest them into the land, concerning which thou hadst
promised to their fathers, that they should go in to possess it.
So can the stars of the
heavens for multitude be numbered by man or can man number the sands of the
sea? No. See Joseph’s futile attempt:
Ge 41:49
And Joseph gathered corn as the sand of the sea, very much, until he left numbering; for it was without
number.
But
Genesis 15:5 And he brought him forth abroad, and said, Look now
toward heaven, and tell the stars, if thou be able to number them: and
he said unto him, So shall thy seed be.
Genesis 32:12 And thou saidst, I will surely do thee good, and
make thy seed as the sand of the sea, which cannot be numbered for
multitude.
Jeremiah 33:22 As the host of heaven cannot be numbered,
neither the sand of the sea measured: so will I multiply the seed of
David my servant, and the Levites that minister unto me.
Hosea 1:10 Yet the number of the children of Israel shall be
as the sand of the sea, which cannot be measured nor numbered; and
it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are
not my people, there it shall be said unto them, Ye are the sons of the living
God.
He definitely is not talking
about a physical enumeration, because that is certainly possible if each member
of the population can be identified.
The clincher for me that puts these matters in their
true perspective is that although old testament Israel were as the sands of the
sea portraying the vast multitudes of the different Judaic-Christian religions
throughout the nations of the world today (vividly illustrated for us in : Re 20:8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which
are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together
to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.), only
a remnant shall be saved and return to God:
Ro 9:27
Esaias also crieth concerning
Isa 10:22 For
though thy people
Other illustrations that come
to mind that support this view of a remnant at the end of time compared to the
vast multitudes of religious folks:
1.
The days of Noah
portrays our day as Christ described (Luke 17 :26) and Noah was a preacher of
righteousness to his generation which means there were religious meetings held
but only 8 persons were saved at the flood. A minor remnant to the population
of that day!
2.
Many are called
but few are chosen (elected) (Matt 22:14).
3.
The road of
religion is broad with many thereon but the road of eternal life is narrow with
only a few treading it:
Matt 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is
the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many
there be which go in thereat: {strait: or,
narrow}
14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is
the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
Thus the great multitude of
Rev 7:9 being the seed of Abraham by faith and comprising folks from every
nation, kindred, and tongue that came out of great tribulation are at best a
remnant in number but still a great multitude when compared with those already
in heaven in their bodily form and they cannot be numbered by man or any other
created being as that prerogative if reserved by God for Himself alone:
De 29:29 The secret things
belong unto the LORD our God: but those things which are revealed belong unto us
and to our children for ever, that we may do all the words of this law.
Other passages illustrating
the sand of the sea as a large number much more than would be expected for the
occasion but which is still countable by man are:
Jos 11:4
And they went out, they and all their hosts with them, much people, even
as the sand that is upon the sea shore in multitude, with horses and chariots very many.
Jud 7:12
And the Midianites and the Amalekites and all the children of the east
lay along in the valley like grasshoppers for multitude; and their camels were
without number, as the sand by the sea
side for multitude.
1Sa 13:5
And the Philistines gathered themselves together to fight with
So, the conclusion stands
that the only reason why man cannot number the great multitude of Rev 7:9 is
that man cannot see the mark or the name that God has placed upon or given each
member of that multitude:
Eze 9:4
And the LORD said unto him, Go through the midst of the city, through
the midst of Jerusalem, and set a mark upon
the foreheads of the men that sigh and that cry for all the abominations that
be done in the midst thereof. {set a mark: Heb. mark a mark}
Eze 9:6 Slay utterly old and young, both
maids, and little children, and women: but come not near any man upon whom is
the mark; and begin at my sanctuary. Then they
began at the ancient men which were before the house.
Isa 62:2
And the Gentiles shall see thy righteousness, and all kings thy glory:
and thou shalt be called by a new name, which the mouth of the LORD shall name.
Re 2:17 He
that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him
that overcometh will I give to eat of the hidden manna, and will give him a
white stone, and in the stone a new name written, which no man knoweth saving he that receiveth it.
Re 3:12
Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he
shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the
name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down
out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.
Joe, thanks very much for your input.
Paul
Comments from Thomas:
To keep all things in perspective of the
current "latter rain" doctrine that is being taught today....
"Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we
have SEALED the servants of our God in their foreheads. And I heard the
number of them which were SEALED: and there were SEALED an
hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of
Who are those that are sealed? The 144,000 out of all the tribes of
"And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are
arrayed in white robes? and whence came they? And I said unto him, Sir, thou
knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great
tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the
blood of the Lamb. Therefore are they before the throne of God, and
serve him day and night in his temple: and he that sitteth on the throne shall
dwell among them. They shall hunger no more, neither thirst any
more; neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat. For the Lamb which is
in the midst of the throne shall feed them, and shall lead them
unto living fountains of waters: and God shall wipe away all tears from
their eyes." Revelation 7:13-17
Those which came out of "great tribulation" are those:
1. Washed their robes
2. Made them white in the blood of the Lamb
3. They are before the throne of God
4. They serve Him day and night in His temple
5. He that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them
6. The shall hunger no more
7. Neither thirst anymore
8. The sun shall not light on them, nor any heat
9. The Lamb in "the midst of them" shall "feed them"
10. Christ shall "lead them unto living fountains of waters
11. God shall "wipe away all tears from their eyes"
And I am to assume that God is only referring to the elect post 1994AD?
That when God shall "wipe away all tears from their eyes" and those
that "serve Him in His temple" in reference to those that came out of
Great Tribulation is referring to the Family Radio era, and not any elect for
the first 13,023 years of history?
I know many think that the good portion of the Bible is a direct fulfillment of
Family Radio and Harold Camping, like Matthew 22:13-14, Matthew 8:12, I Cor
6:2, just to name a few, are that these verses are just focusing on the elect
just over the last few years during the era of Open Forum, and not all the
elect. Is that really Biblical?
Something to think about...
TG.
Response of the Author:
I believe what Thomas has
written above is also my understanding of the LR teachings as is
promoted on their Yahoo board.
Now any religious group can
always make claims about their truths but the test is always to check what
they say from the whole Bible and to see if it will pass the test.
I have written openly to you
what I have found and that is I cannot find anywhere in the Bible where I
am told that the great multitude of Rev 7:9 were saved during the GT. If we go
by what LR is saying then if there are any of us who became saved prior to
1988 and are still alive in 2011 (if indeed that is the year of the rapture) then
we will not be a part of the great multitude of the rapture coming from earth
into heaven out of great tribulation!
Also, try as I may, I cannot
see from scriptures that the great multitude is millions upon millions as is
currently being proclaimed. The verses and illustrations as shown in my
studies that prevail upon me are:
Ro 9:27
Esaias also crieth concerning
Isa 10:22 For
though thy people
1. The days of Noah portrays our day as Christ described (Luke
17:26) and Noah was a preacher of righteousness to his generation which means
there were religious meetings held but only 8 persons were saved at the flood.
A minor remnant to the population of that day!
2. Many are
called but few are chosen (elected) (Matt 22:14).
3. The road
of religion is broad with many thereon but the road of eternal life is narrow
with only a few treading it:
Matt 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait
gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to
destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: {strait: or, narrow}
14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is
the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
If you find otherwise, I
would certainly like to be enlightened and openly to the group so that we all
may benefit there from.
In Christ,
Paul
Comments from Ken:
"a remnant
shall be saved"????
Speaking
of God's ultimate Plan, we read that...
."all
Furthermore, the
two people who, arguably, could be called mankind's greatest sinners, Adam and
Eve, they will be saved also, "if
they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety" (I
Timothy 2:15)....which they will. How do I know? Because I know God is
sovereign over all of His creatures and He has decreed that "unto me every knee shall bow, every tongue
shall sware" (Isaiah 45:23). Thus we read in I
Timothy 2:4, that God will have...
."all men to be
saved."
--Ken
Response by Author:
Hi Ken,
Thanks for commenting above. Let us take a quick look at the verses you
quoted and I will provide my brief understanding of them:
1tim 2:15 Notwithstanding
she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity {love-agape}
and holiness with sobriety.
“She” refers to Eve who was
the mother of all living (Gen 3:20) because it is from her descendant (Mary)
that the Lord Jesus Christ (the Savior) was born and this is the “child
bearing” that is in view and is the seed of the woman that was promised (Gen
3:15). “They” refers to the women in general (discussed earlier in verses 9 to
12) who seek to usurp authority over men. They too will be saved provided they
possess Christ’s faith, His love, and His holiness with sobriety (conformance
of their behavior to Christ’s holy standards) in their perseverance in this earthly
life.
Isa 45:23 I
have sworn by myself, the word is gone out of my mouth in righteousness,
and shall not return, That unto me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall
swear.
Isa 45:24 Surely, shall one say, in the LORD have I righteousness and strength: even to him shall men come; and all that are incensed against him shall be ashamed.
I included verse 24 for
context. Yes, ever knee will bow and ever tongue will confess (swear) at the
judgment seat of Christ:
Ro 14:10 But why dost thou judge thy
brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand
before the judgment seat of Christ.
11 For it is written, As
I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall
confess to God.
12 So then every one of us shall give account of himself
to God.
So everyone shall give
account of himself to God but going back to Isaiah 45:24, those who are
incensed against God shall be put to shame in His judgment.
Ro
11:26 And so all <3956>
1Ti 2:4
Who will have all <3956> men to be saved, and to come unto the
knowledge of the truth.
Please note that the Strongs number for “all” is 3956 and
we have to understand words in their context and not by mere isolation. “All”
refers to the whole population of a group that is in view exclusive of any
other similar groups. For demonstration, take the following verse:
Lu 2:1 And it came to pass in
those days, that there went out a decree from Caesar Augustus, that all <3956> the world should be taxed. {taxed: or, enrolled}
If we apply the meaning of
“all” in isolation, then the above verse would be saying that the people who
were, at that time of Jesus’ birth, living in China, North and South America,
West Indies, Australia, etc. were included in the enrollment. We know this is
not true. But when “all” is understood in its context of the whole population
of a group then we understand that the whole population of the Roman world of
that time was in view. This inference is further explicated below:
Re 13:8 And all <3956> that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written
in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
If we were to read the first
part of the verse in isolation we would get the impression that every single
person on the earth will worship the beast but when we read on we see that the
group that will be worshipping the beast is restricted to those whose names
were not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of
the world and all in this group shall worship the beast!
So going back to Romans 11:26
and 1Timothy 2:4 and applying what we just learned we realize that the terms
“all Israel” and “all men” are referring to every individual within the group
that is predestined to experience salvation by having their names written in
the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world!
In Christ,
Paul
Comments by Michael:
Hi Everyone,
Just found the verse Romans
11:26
26
And so all
27 For
this [is] my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
All
The
second is "
1.
Jacob who's name was changed to
2. National Israel of the
flesh: Romans 9:31, Romans 9:6, Romans 10:19, 21 Philippians 3:5
3.
The elect and chosen of God
4.
The Corporate Church today is also similar to the National Israel.
So
Romans 11:26 in this usage is making reference to the Elect and Chosen Of God
Also, I forgot
Romans 9:6 is also making reference to the Elect and Chosen of God:
Not
as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they [are] not all
May The Lord
Richly Bless You,
Michael
**********************************************************************************************
Comments by JYblueangel:
What part of >>.which
no man can number<<< do you people NOT understand????
Author’s response to
Jyblueangel:
Thanks for your terse
response. You are correct that no man or no one can number the great multitude
of Rev 7:9 even as scripture declares. I simple wanted to show that the reason
for man not being able to do so is because the great multitude has no
distinguishing observable mark that is placed on them by God at the point of
salvation.
The more important part of my
consideration was I wanted to see if scriptures revealed the timing of their
salvation. I just like to search the scriptures for whatever is on my mind and
then share it with others like yourself and ask for your input from scriptures.
Thanks for considering our
deliberations. May God richly bless you.
Paul
Further comment from
JYblueangel:
I guess my response is DEUT
29:29 ;0)
Author’s response to Jyblueangel:
Again, you are correct! Deut
29:29 is one of the first verses that stuck in my mind when I first became
acquainted with the gospel and as far as humanly possible I try to keep its
import in my searching of scriptures in obedience to passages like:
Joh 5:39 Search the scriptures;
for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of
me.
1Cor 2:12 Now we
have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God;
that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.13 Which
things also we speak, not in the words which man’s wisdom teacheth, but which
the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
Ac 17:11 These
were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with
all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures
daily, whether those things were so.
Thanks Jay for your sharing.
Paul
Comments from Ed H:
I see in your study that it
appears that you speak of the great multitude including those who had been
saved before the tribulation that yet live, I agree -
We read the following -
Revelation 6:9-11
And when he had opened the fifth
seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of
God, and for the testimony which they held:
And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and
true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the
earth? And
white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto
them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellow
servants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.
This verse above clearly indicants that every one that
was saved before the tribulation received white robes waiting for their fellow
servants (the elect of God) to come into the flock (killed - to be saved) the
end of the resting period is when “should be fulfilled” which is a direct statement we read in -
Romans 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
The fulfillment of the Gospel is when all the elect
come into God's kingdom.
The sealing of all the tribes can only be when all the
elect come into the
Revelation 7:4 And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.
2 Corinthians 1:21-22
Now he which stablisheth us with
you in Christ, and hath anointed us, is
God; Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in
our hearts.
Ephesians 1:13 In whom ye also trusted,
after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom
also after that ye believed, ye were sealed
with that holy Spirit of promise,
Surely those being saved in the tribulation period have also been
sealed! Therefore the four angles being loosed in Revelation 7 can not happen
until all the elect have come into God’s kingdom.
Revelation 7:1-3 And after these things I saw four angels standing on
the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the
wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree. And I saw another angel ascending from the
east, having the seal of the living God: and he cried with a loud voice to the
four angels, to whom it was given to hurt the earth and the sea, Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea,
nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of
our God in their foreheads.
Secondly we read - Revelation 7:9-10
After
this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all
nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and
before the Lamb, clothed with white robes,
and palms in their hands; And cried with
a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and
unto the Lamb.
After what? The tribulation period –
Matthew 24:29 Immediately after the
tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall
not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the
heavens shall be shaken:
It is the same point in which we read – “After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;…” and what where the elect given before the days of rest in Revelation 6 “And white robes were given unto every one of them”
I believe that Revelation 6:9-11 “little season” is the same period as
Revelation 7 during the tribulation period. Then we read after the tribulation
the completeness of our salvation with our fellow servants in –
Revelation 7:9-15 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all
nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and
before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands; And cried with a loud voice, saying,
Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb. And all the angels stood round about the
throne, and about the elders and the
four beasts, and fell before the throne on their faces, and worshipped God, Saying, Amen: Blessing, and glory, and
wisdom, and thanksgiving, and honour, and power, and might, be unto our God for ever and ever. Amen. And one of the elders answered, saying unto
me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes?
and whence came they? And I said unto
him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of
great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the
blood of the Lamb. Therefore are they
before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple: and he
that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them.
Note –
Revelation 19:1-9 And after these things I heard a great voice of much
people in heaven, saying, Alleluia; Salvation, and glory, and honour, and
power, unto the Lord our God: For
true and righteous are his judgments:
for he hath judged the great whore, which did corrupt the earth with her
fornication, and hath avenged the blood of his servants at her hand. And again they said, Alleluia. And her smoke
rose up for ever and ever. And the
four and twenty elders and the four beasts fell down and worshipped God that
sat on the throne, saying, Amen; Alleluia.
And a voice came out of the throne, saying, Praise our God, all ye his
servants, and ye that fear him, both small and great. And I heard as it were the voice of a great multitude, and as the voice of many waters,
and as the voice of mighty thunderings, saying, Alleluia: for the Lord God
omnipotent reigneth. Let us be glad and
rejoice, and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come,
and his wife hath made herself ready.
And to her was granted that she should be
arrayed in fine linen, clean and white:
for the fine linen is the righteousness of saints. And he saith unto me, Write, Blessed are they which are called unto the marriage
supper of the Lamb. And he saith unto me, These are the true sayings of God.
Yes there is much more that we can look at.
The END.